What does the Bible say about Jesus?   (Answering Trinity) Rebuttal

Greetings to all, this paper takes a deeper look at Osama’s Rebuttal page located at http://www.answering-christianity.com/trinity.htm His comments are in green.  He claims that I didn’t post a legitamate rebuttal but when we look at the evidence we will see that Mr. Osama is very unoriginal and really doesn’t have an answer for my page answering his trinity page.

Note: Please see my comments on answering-islam's rebuttal to this page after the "Conclusion" section on this page below.  You will also see a link for my rebuttal to their claims.  Just for the sake of record, they only picked and chose from my page and responded to just 30% of my whole argument.  They failed to answer my "Hebrew" and "Greek" references that I presented on this page.  Instead, they twisted the meanings of some key words in Hebrew and Greek to try to fool the reader.  Please visit brother Mohd Elfie Nieshaem Juferi's rebuttal  to see how he showed in great details from the Christian "Bible Study Tools" web site (which presents the Bible in Greek and Hebrew) that their arguments are wrong and misleading.

This isn’t the truth, I responded to most of Osama’s claims, usually he modifies his site so much because most of his material is usually rebuttaled on idjnet.  During that time that I wrote a rebuttal, the page of his site I download wasn’t the very current one. He is good at claiming that I twisted words and that I didn’t answer his Greek and Hebrew references. If he is so sure of himself, one must ask this question. “Why didn’t you post my link to your page to show the reader what you are talking about?”  Anybody can make claims but without proving them, what good is your rebuttal? Especially to a page that nobody seems to know the link to!!!! Also read my rebuttal to Mr. Mohd Elfie at http://www.geocities.com/queball23/Answeringfriend.html to see just how weak and fallible Mr. Mohd’s arument is. Now lets start on Osama’s rebuttal. Some of his material he just reposted again. Much was answered already on my link at http://www.geocities.com/queball23/Quennel.html

Most Christians today claim that God Almighty came down to earth in a form of a human being and died for our sins to forgive all of us.  This is a belief that I struggled with for 3 years of my life.  I was between Christianity and Islam not knowing which religion is the right one.  I knew that both can not be true.  One of them had to be false.

This is a lie because if you read Osama’s comments you see that he was always a Muslim and that he had no intentions of ever becoming a Christian:

As'salamu Alaikum Wa Rahmatu Allah Wa Barakatuh (God's peace, mercy and blessings be upon you) and upon your families as well

Due to a number of misunderstandings that happened by some of the Christian readers, I would like to identify the purpose of why I created this web site. When I came to the U.S. in 1988, I didn't know anything about Christianity.  I was born and raised as a Muslim in the Middle East.  When I became involved in the internet and surfed it quite a lot, I came across so many ANTI-ISLAMIC web sites that were posted by Christians who were mostly Arab Christians. There are only 1.5 million Muslims in the Entire United States of America, and I found it to be very disturbing that the internet has so much ANTI-ISLAMIC sites against us.  I felt that everyone was ganging up on us.

Now if Osama struggled with Christianity for 3 years then why does he say on his purpose that 1.) He doesn’t know anything about Christianity 2.) I was born and raised a Muslim, 3.) I was raised a Muslim and 4.) I felt that everyone was gainging up on us.  If he struggled between these two religions did he do it here or in the Middle East? Apparently since he didn’t know anything about it until he came to the U.S. he must to have struggled between it here.  But he didn’t mention anything about this matter, he said that he felt that everybody was ganging upon “US” the Muslims, so apparently he didn’t have anytime to really struggle between Christianity and Islam as he so eloquently claims. This is seen further in his comments like this:

Now, I hope you would understand my position and intentions very well here.  After I became very disturbed by the overwhelming majority of Christians putting down my religion in the U.S., I decided to take it upon myself and to defend my religion with the best of my ability.  I think any loyal, good, and faithful person to his religion and people would do what I did.  I didn't come to the U.S. to battle Christians nor I ever thought about the religion of Christianity when I was back home.  I found myself thrown into this battle of religions here and I had no choice.  The last thing I wanted to happen is to see our young Muslim brothers and sisters who are born here in the U.S. get too effected by the religion of Christianity that its followers who try to force it upon them through the internet and the media and have them convert without knowing the real truth about both religions:  Islam and Christianity.

Oh!! Very interesting, he became disturbed by Christianity and then he took it upon himself to defend his religion not to think between which one to convert to.  Ladies and Gentlemen now you know why you can’t trust people like him.

Exaggerating expressions in the Bible:  The Bible contains many verses in it that contain irrational statements that make absolutely no sense!.  For instance we read in Matthew 21:21 " Jesus replied, 'I tell you the truth, if you have faith and do not doubt, not only can you do what was done to the fig tree, but also you can say to this mountain, 'Go, throw yourself into the sea,' and it will be done.  If you believe, you will receive whatever you ask for in prayer.'"  I challenge any "faithful" believing Christian to move one brick, not a mountain with his sight or words.  Have any Christian from the time of Jesus till now been able to do it?

That isn’t the point, the bible doesn’t tell us to move things with sight or words, it is talking about faith!!! Mr. Osama uses the word “faithful” in his sentence but yet he seems to forget the meaning of it when he says “with his sight or words”.  Faith has never meant using sight or words.  The Bible says that “we walk by faith and not by sight”.

Does this mean no "Christian" is a real Christian?  Did Jesus say that no one will ever be a believer?

Osama starts off with this confusion and then builds a strawman argument from it. Jesus never mentioned anything about “no one will ever be a  believer”.  Just read Matthew 21:21 to find out for yourself.

Does the Bible contain "non sense" expressions in it? and if so, then how can you take the "Trinitarian" verses so literal then?

Trinitarians today base their entire belief basically on the following Biblical verses:  Isaiah 9:6,  John 1:1, John 5:58, Revelations 1:8, Daniel 7:13, and Daniel 7:28. These verses sound like they are talking about God, but in reality, they are not.  Here is my answer to them:

Isaiah 9:6.  "For there has been a child born to us, there has been a son given to us; and the princely rule will come to be upon his shoulder.  And his name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace."

As this verse (Isaiah 9:6) is broken down and analyzed thoroughly throughout this page, you will see that for instance:  David was called the "O mighty one" in Psalm 45:3, and "God" in Psalm 45:7.  Of course this doesn't mean that David was GOD or Jehovah or The Mighty One.  Also Moses in Exodus 7:1 was called "like God" too.

No the bible doesn’t contain nonsense in it.  Osama is telling us that he doesn’t know how to differentiate between literal and parable verses!!! That is unbelievable.  They teach you this in grade school.  Osama better go back and relearn what he forgot so he won’t make himself look so silly with these answers of his.  As for his effort to debunk the trinity, lets look at it closely.

For one thing trinitarians don't base their whole belief on these group of scriptures. In Psalms 45:3 the term used for David isn't ELOHIM in Hebrew so this term of "MIGHTY ONE" can't be used as a defense because if the reader researches this they will find out that Might God is present in Isaiah 9:6 while it's not in Psalms 45:3. This scripture doesn't show that David was God nor does it disprove the idea of Isaiah 9:6 because "God"- Elohim is present in Isaiah 9:6 while just the word in Hebrew for Mighty one is located in Psalms 45:3. Elohim is spelled with an "Aleph" as the first letter while mighty one in Psalms 45:3 is spelled with a "gemel". If Osama doesn’t believe me he can take the link that Mr. Mohd used and go and check it out for himself. He claims that nobody answered his Hebrew references but yet from reading this we see that he thinks that Elohim is the same a gibbor, the word used in Psalms 45:3! Great Hebrew knowledge Osama.

Now in this passage Jesus was called "MIGHTY GOD". The Bible only uses this term to describe GOD, just look at Isaiah 10:21-"The remnant shall return, even the remnant of Jacob, unto the mighty God." This scripture clearly says that Israel shall return to God. In Jeremiah 32:18-"Thou shewest loving kindness unto thousands, and recompensest the iniquity of the fathers into the bosom of their children after them: the Great, the Mighty God, the LORD of hosts, is his name." The same term used for Jesus was used for God- "THE MIGHTY GOD". When you continue down in the passage to 32:20-21-

20 Which hast set signs and wonders in the land of Egypt, even unto this day, and  in Israel, and among other men; and hast made thee a name, as at this day;                                                                                                                      21 And hast brought forth thy people Israel out of the land of Egypt with signs, and with wonders, and with a strong hand, and with a stretched out arm, and with great terror;

You see that "The MIGHTY GOD" brought the Jews out of the land of Egypt as well as performed the signs and wonders. The evidence presented against Jesus not being God doesn't stand up under close scrutiny because the bible says that "Mighty God", along with the Lord of hosts is the name of God. As for Exodus 7:1 the term applied to Moses and the Israelites judges is elohim, which is correctly translated as "gods" having the plural ending "im" in Hebrew.

The word "God" was used numerous times throughout the Bible to show someone's special authority throughout the Old Testament. But the GOD of the Bible is One GOD; see verses Genesis 18:14, Exodus 5:2, 6:3, 15:3, 20:7, 34:6, Leviticus 19:2, Deuteronomy 4:24, 6:5, 10:17, Isaiah 2:6, 16:7, 17:47, Nehemiah 4:14, Psalm 3:8, and Jeremiah 10:10  Where they all talk about Jehovah being the living One God and King.

I don’t disagree, God is one God but however the term “ONE” has never meant just a single numerical one. Out of all of the words for "one", the only word that would prove beyond a doubt that God is just an absolute "one" would be yachid. If this word is applied to God (Elohim) in the O.T., then this would be a death sentence for the Trinitarian believers. The word "yachid" means an absolute or solitary one. (Francis Brown, S.R. Driver, and Charles Briggs, "A Hebrew and English Lexicon of the Old Testament"; Oxford, Clarendon, 1966 pg. 402). This word is never applied to God because "Elohim conveys both the unity of the one God, and yet allows for the plurality of Divine Persons as expressed in the historical Christian doctrine of the Trinity. It is unique to monotheistic Israel and is not found in the language of any of her polytheistic, Semitic neighbors (Jack B. Scott, S.V. "elohim", in Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament, 2 vols:, Chicago, Moody Press, 1980, 1:44).

In Deuteronomy 6:4, the Shema, Echad "STRESSES UNITY, WHILE RECOGNIZING DIVERSITY WITHIN THAT ONENESS" (Herbert Wolf, S.V. "echad", Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament, 1:30). When we turn to the Old Testament, what do we find? The writers of the Old Testament never applied yachid to God. God is never described as a solitary person. If this is the case why do Unitarians, especially Muslims try to tell Christians that it's an error believing on the Trinity when the Hebrew Text, that they use in their defense so much, shows God in the compound and not the single entity?

Now, in Isaiah 9:6 "For there has been a child born to us..............",

let us look at Isaiah 7:14 "Therefore Jehovah himself will give you men a sign:  Look ! The maiden herself will actually become pregnant, and she is giving birth to a son (Jesus the same person in Isaiah 9:6), and she will certainly call his name Immanuel."  Here in Isaiah 7:14 we see Allah Almighty or Jehovah is speaking clearly to the people of Israel predicting to them the coming of Prophet Jesus peace be upon him.  It doesn't say that "Jehovah" will come down and will be born from that woman.

What Mr. Osama seems to forget is that Jesus was called MIGHTY GOD!!! No other person other than God or Jesus in the O.T. was called "THE MIGHTY GOD" If Osama can find one please let us know.

Also, let us look at Luke 1:34 - 1:35 "But Mary said to the angel: How is this to be, since I am having no intercourse with a man?  In answer the angel said to her:  Holy Spirit will come upon you, and power of the Most High will overshadow you.  For that reason also what is born will be called holy, God's Son." Again, here in this verse we don't see Allah Almighty or Jehovah saying that he will be born from Mary the Virgin.  The angel told her that she will have a miracle by becoming pregnant without intercourse, and she will bring a holy person to life.  

First of all if we look at Isaiah 9:6 we see that Jesus is called MIGHTY GOD, EVERLASTING FATHTER, ETC. In Proverbs 30:4-

Who has gone up to heaven and come down? Who has gathered up the wind in the hollow of his hands? Who has wrapped up the waters in his cloak? Who has established all the ends of the earth? What is his name, and the name of his son? Tell me if you know!

 We see that God has a son. Here in Luke 1:34-35, it says that Jesus was to be called THE SON OF GOD.  Here are some relevant scriptures dealing with Son of God. 

Matthew 14:33-Then those who were in the boat worshiped him, saying, "Truly you are the Son of God."

Matthew 26:63-

68 But Jesus remained silent. The high priest said to him, "I charge you under oath by the living God: Tell us if you are the Christ, the Son of God."                                                                                                                              64"Yes, it is as you say," Jesus replied. "But I say to all of you: In the future you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven."                                                                        65Then the high priest tore his clothes and said, "He has spoken blasphemy! Why do we need any more witnesses? Look, now you have heard the blasphemy.                                                                                                         66What do you think?" "He is worthy of death," they answered.                                                                       67Then they spit in his face and struck him with their fists. Others slapped him                                                     68and said, "Prophesy to us, Christ. Who hit you?"

These are just a very few scriptures.  If Jesus was just a holy person and not God’s unique Son then why did the priest become so angry and then spit on him just because he claimed to be the Son of God? Wasn’t it because he claimed deity?  Yes. 

Also, let us look at Mathew 1:18-21 "But the birth of Jesus Christ was in this way.  During the time his mother Mary was promised in marriage to Joseph, and was found to be pregnant by holy spirit before they were united.  How ever, Joseph her husband, because he was righteous and did not want to maker her a public spectacle, intended to divorce her secretly.  But after he had thought these things over, look ! Jehovah's angel appeared to him in a dream, saying:  Joseph, son of David, do not be afraid to take Mary your wife home, for that which has been begotten in her is by holy spirit.  She will give birth to a son, and you must call his name Jesus for he will save his people from their sins".  This verse clearly doesn't state that Jehovah was going to be born from Mary the Virgin.  It states that someone other than Jehovah who's name will be "Jesus" will be born from her.

Also, let us look at John 1:14 "So the word became flesh and resided among us, and we had a view of his glory such as belongs to an only-begotten son from a father; and he was full of undeserved kindness and truth."  Again, this verse clearly states that Jehovah or Allah didn't come in a form of a man.  It was God's son who came to us.  God's only begotten son.  Further down in my paper you will see the real definition of the word "Son" and what it really means.  The word "Son" doesn't mean actual biological son at all.  You will see it further down.

Let us look at Luke 2:11 "Because there was born to you today a Savior, who is Christ (the) Lord, in David's city."   The word "Lord" in here doesn't mean GOD or Allah Almighty at all.  It simply means the master or the leader or the teacher or the most respected or the most admired among his people.  But it certainly doesn't refer to the Creator of this Universe.  That is not what the word Lord means.  We use the word "Lord" a lot for "Drug Lords" or "Market Lords", etc....  They are not GODs.  These Lords are simply powerful people who have a lot of influence on us.

Defining the meaning of the word "Son":

Now in Isaiah 9:6 "....there has been a son given to us,.........",

Now let us look at John 3:16 "For God loved the world so much that he gave his only begotten Son, in order that everyone exercising faith in him might not be destroyed but have everlasting life."  Ironically, Trinitarians from my personal experience with them rely on this verse (John 3:16) very heavily when trying to prove that Allah or Jehovah came down to earth to die for our sins.  They claim that Jesus being God's unique son, makes him the only Son for God, which ultimately lead us to the conclusion that Jehovah is Jesus.

Also, let us look at Hebrews 11:17 "By faith Abraham, when God tested him, offered Isaac as a sacrifice.  He who had received the promises was about to sacrifice his one and only son...."  Abraham had two sons:  Ishmael and Isaac.  Ishmael was 13 years older than Isaac.  Yet we see that "his one and only son" expression was used for Isaac.  The Bible uses expressions like this to magnify people or to glorify someone on a certain occasion.  The Bible in this verse glorifies Isaac for being the chosen sacrifice to God.  So Jesus being God's "only begotten Son" in John 3:16 doesn't make him God nor the only Son of God.

Now lets talk about Osama’s misunderstanding of  “ONLY BEGOTTEN SON”.  The word for “ONLY” in the Greek language is “MONOGENES” which is defined, as the only one of it’s kind.  The reason why Christian apologists can claim this is because we know the meaning of this word “only”.  For more information we turn to Strong’s Concordance of the Bible for the word:                                                 Monogenes

                                                               Definition:

1.single of its kind, only a. used of only sons or daughters (viewed in relation to their parents)                                   b.used of Christ, denotes the only begotten son of God

Mr. Osama attempts to use Hebrews 11:17 by claiming that Abraham has 2 sons and that “only” is used to magnify or to glorify someone on a certain occasion.  This tries to discredit the meaning of “Monogenes”, only in Greek.  But if we read Hebrews 11:17-18- “By faith Abraham when he was tested, offered up Isaac, and he who had received the promises offered up his only (monogenes) begotten son of whom it was said, IN ISAAC YOUR SEED SHALL BE CALLED.”

This is why we see that Isaac was called Abraham’s only begotten son because it was through Isaac “ONLY” and ALONE and not Ishmael in which Abraham’s seed would be established.  There are many in the Bible that was called SONS, but there is only one person that is called GOD’S ONLY BEGOTTEN SON. This person was Jesus.  This is something Mr. Osama can’t discredit because all one has to do is to go to any online Greek Concordance and check out the word “MONOGENES”. Let Mr. Mohd help you, since he is such an expert using Strong’s concordance. Notice my reader, Osama couldn’t even provide a legitimate answer on his rebuttal. He couldn’t even find a single scripture in the Bible where anybody is called God’s only (monogenes) son. So much for his Greek reference.

Now, Let us look at Exodus 4:22 "Thus saith Jehovah, Israel is my son, even my firstborn."  Here we see in this verse that Israel is not only God's so called "Son", but also his first born !!.  Does this mean that Jehovah is Israel?  Does it mean that we must worship Israel as Jehovah or Allah?  Of course not !!!

Also, let us look at Jeremiah 31:9 "I am a father to Israel, and Ephraim is my firstborn."  Ephraim in this verse means Israel.  This verse is similar to Exodus 4:22.

Let us also look at Psalm 2:7 "....Jehovah had said onto me (David), thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee."  Here in this verse we see that God not only called David his "Son", but also had made him his begotten Son  !!!.

Mr. Osama tries hard to equate “firstborn” to “only” in Greek.  To anyone who looks at these scriptures you can easily see that both Ephraim and David wasn’t called GOD’S ONLY BEGOTTEN SON!  Only is Monogenes while first born is Prototokos, so Osama if you say you have something only do you use Firstborn to indicate that also? 

Swapping Game:  Let us play a little swapping game between the verses of John 3:16, Exodus 4:22, Jeremiah 31:9, and Psalm 2:7.  Let us take "his only begotten Son" from John 3:16 and replace it in Exodus 4:22, and let us take "even my firstborn" from Exodus 4:22 and replace it in John 3:16.  

Do you honestly think that the little swap game above would change anything in the meaning?  Would you still have believed in Jesus as Jehovah if the above swap was true?  

The above swap proves that the word "Son" doesn't mean actual biological "Son" at all.   It just means that Jesus is a "Son" of Jehovah in a way that Jehovah loved him so much that he chose him to be his messenger to the people of Israel.

For one thing in order to do the swapping game we must take two phrases from 2 totally different languages and replace them with each other!!!!  You can’t do this since Exodus was written in ancient Hebrew while John 3:16 was written in 1st century Greek!  Tell me Osama, how can you substitute a Greek Phrase into a Hebrew one?  Hebrew is written from right to left while Greek is written from left to right! This is impossible!  So why does Osama ask us to swap?  Easy, simply because he relies on an English translation of the Bible.  There are many excellent Hebrew and Greek language texts and concordances that can be used to check the English translations of the Bible, not to mention the online Biblical resources.  Is this your great Greek and Hebrew reference Osama?  Ladies and Gentleman this was on my original site. Osama just copied and paste for a rebuttal. He didn’t even link my site to his because he is afraid the reader will see his argument and discard it.

 If David wanted to put “ONLY” into Psalms 2:7, etc then yachid that is “only” in Hebrew would’ve been used. So tell us Osama how does swapping two different terms from two totally different languages disprove son? Especially since this swapping game doesn’t exist.  I think you need to start getting serious and stop playing games because these types of arguments look foolish at best.

Another Swapping Game:  Let us replace "I begotten thee" from Psalm 2:7, and replace it in John 3:16, and take "his only begotten Son" from John 3:16 and replace it in Psalm 2:7

Again, do you honestly think that the little swap game above would change anything in the meaning?  Would you still have believed in Jesus as Jehovah if the above swap was true?  

Clearly, the above swap proves that the word "Son" doesn't mean actual biological "Son" at all.   It just means that Jesus is a "Son" of Jehovah in a way that Jehovah loved him so much that he chose him to be his messenger to the people of Israel.

Notice Osama clearly says “Would you still have believed in Jesus as Jehovah IF THE ABOVE SWAP WAS TRUE”!!!  Notice the world “IF” present here.  Then he goes on to say that the swap disproves Jesus deity, but yet he says IF THE SWAP WAS TRUE!!  There is no bible with these words with it on earth, so apparently SINCE this swap isn’t true then Osama contradicts himself by using it when it even isn’t true!!! Unbelievable.  I wonder would Mr. Mohd agree with him, if he does, I challenge him to go and find a bible with these scriptures worded like Osama wants them.  Dear reader Osama has to twist the meaning to prove his point. Such a weak defense.

Jesus worshiping his God:

Let us look at Luke 5:16 "And he (Jesus) withdrew himself into the wilderness and prayed to his God."  Here we see that Jesus had a God, a supreme God, who is higher than him and stronger than him.  Jesus was God's servant and he prayed to God so God would strengthen him more and reinforce him with patience and desire to continue his mission in spreading the word of God Almighty.

If we go to the Greek Text, we find out that the word for God, which is “Theos”, isn’t present at all! From Greek: Autos de en Hupochoreo en ho Eremos kai Proseuchomai. Why does Mr. Osama have to add words to the scripture in order to prove his point?  I challenge anyone to go and check out every bible out there and find “praying to his God” in it.  You won’t find it because it doesn’t exist. Even in the NIV Bible which Osama claims to debate from, the word for God isn’t present. Ladies and gentlemen Osama swears up and down that he would debate from the NIV but this verse mentioned this way isn’t even found in the NIV. He is a great liar. 

Also, let us look at Matthew 26:39 "And going a little way forward, he (Jesus) fell upon his face, praying and saying 'My Father, if it is possible, let this cup pass away from me.  Yet, not as I will, but as you will.' "  Here in this verse we see two things:   (1) Jesus bowed down on his face and prayed in submission to his GOD in obedience.   (2) Jesus was begging his GOD to let the cup pass away from him.  Jesus did not have the power to will it for himself and make the cup pass away from Jesus.  GOD had to do it for Jesus !.  How can Jesus be the Creater of this Universe, the all knowing, most powerful??!!

We see no such meaning at all, Jesus was in the garden and was about to be crucified, read:

37 He took Peter and the two sons of Zebedee along with him, and he began to be sorrowful and troubled.              38 Then he said to them, "My soul is overwhelmed with sorrow to the point of death. Stay here and keep watch with me."                                                                                                                                                                        39 Going a little farther, he fell with his face to the ground and prayed, "My Father, if it is possible, may this cup be taken from me. Yet not as I will, but as you will."

Jesus was overwhelmed because he was about to face the cross not because he was praying out of obedience, something which Osama doesn’t show, by not posting any content.  Osama even says that Jesus was begging to take the cup away from him, since he believes this then he must believe that Jesus was crucified!!! He then builds a strawman argument by claiming that how could Jesus be all knowing and most powerful, simple, since he predicted his death and then it was about to happen this shows that he was all-knowing and all powerful.

Also, let us look at Matthew 26:42 "Again, for the second time, he (Jesus) went off and prayed, saying: 'My Father, if it is not possible for this to pass away except I drink it, let your will take place.'"  My comments on this verse are similar to the above one (Matthew 26:39), Jesus begged his GOD to will what Jesus wanted to happen.  Jesus couldn't will it by himself.

No wonder why Osama thought that Jesus couldn’t will it by himself, he didn’t post any content to it. Read:

41 "Watch and pray so that you will not fall into temptation. The spirit is willing, but the body is weak."                     42 He went away a second time and prayed, "My Father, if it is not possible for this cup to be taken away unless I drink it, may your will be done."

Notice Jesus spirit was willing but his body was weak.  Once again I must reiterate, Osama must believe in the crucifixion of Christ if he is posting these verses.

Also, let us look at Matthew 26:44 "So leaving them, he (Jesus) went off and prayed for the third time, saying once more the same word."  Here we see that Jesus for the third time begged his GOD to will what Jesus wished for in Matthew 26:39 above.  How can Jesus be the Creater of this Universe if he (1) begs, and (2) lacks power??!!

Jesus is praying not begging, and no he doesn’t lack power as Osama claims, infact since Osama believes this he obviously must believe that Jesus was to be crucified, read Matthew 26:45-56-

45 Then he returned to the disciples and said to them, "Are you still sleeping and resting? Look, the hour is near, and the Son of Man is betrayed into the hands of sinners.                                                                                                                         46 Rise, let us go! Here comes my betrayer!"                                                                                                                       47 While he was still speaking, Judas, one of the Twelve, arrived. With him was a large crowd armed with swords and clubs, sent from the chief priests and the elders of the people.                                                                                                         48 Now the betrayer had arranged a signal with them: "The one I kiss is the man; arrest him."                                         49 Going at once to Jesus, Judas said, "Greetings, Rabbi!" and kissed him.                                                                  50 Jesus replied, "Friend, do what you came for."Then the men stepped forward, seized Jesus and arrested him.        51 With that, one of Jesus' companions reached for his sword, drew it out and struck the servant of the high priest, cutting off his ear.                                                                                                                                                    52 "Put your sword back in its place," Jesus said to him, "for all who draw the sword will die by the sword.                  53 Do you think I cannot call on my Father, and he will at once put at my disposal more than twelve legions of angels? 54 But how then would the Scriptures be fulfilled that say it must happen in this way?"                                                55 At that time Jesus said to the crowd, "Am I leading a rebellion, that you have come out with swords and clubs to capture me? Every day I sat in the temple courts teaching, and you did not arrest me.                                                        56 But this has all taken place that the writings of the prophets might be fulfilled.

You see how trying to refute the bible, Osama is making himself look bad!! He can’t be Islamic since he believes these scriptures. I guess he just likes to pick and choose out of context.

Now in Isaiah 9:6 "......and the princely rule will come to be upon his shoulder......",

Let us look at Luke 22:29 "and I make a covenant with you, just as my Father (my GOD) has made a covenant with me, for a kingdom,".  Here we see that Jesus came down to serve Jehovah's Kingdom.  It wasn't Jehovah who was in Jesus in this verse.  It was Jesus the Messenger of God who was serving his God's Kingdom, Jehovah's Kingdom.

If we read in the next verse we see that Jesus said – “that you may eat and drink at MY TABLE IN MY KINGDOM…” If Jesus was serving Jehovah’s Kingdom like Osama claims, then why did he say IN MY KINGDOM?  When we look at this we clearly see that Jesus is claiming God’s kingdom to be HIS KINGDOM.  Mr. Osama doesn’t put these scriptures because he expects the readers not to go and check for themselves.  I’ve been on his discussion board, on his site, and I’ve seen Muslims say wow, your site is very informative, etc.  It looks that way on the surface until someone goes and actually researches what Osama claims.  This again was answered on my first site, however Osama thinks that he can fool his reader by reposting the same information again and then claiming that it wasn’t answered.  This works well with Muslims and this might explain why he is to wimpy enough to post my link to allow the reader to judge from both sides.

Let us look at  2 Samuel 7:13 -14 "He (David) is the one that will build a house for My Name (Jehovah's Name), and I shall certainly establish the throne of his kingdom firmly to time indefinite.  I myself shall become his Father (His Guardian or Inspirer), and he himself will become my son.  When he does wrong, I will also reprove him with the rod of men and with the strokes of the sons of Adam."  In this verse, we see that David who came before Jesus had done the same thing to God as Jesus did.  David was a king, leader, and a messenger from God.  It doesn't say that Jehovah is in David, nor it says that David is Jehovah.  The same way we interpret 2 Samuel 7:13-14  and all the verses about David should be the same way we should interpret the Verses that talk about Jesus.  Jesus is not Jehovah, nor ever was.

Now lets look at 2 Samuel 7:13-14.  Osama tries to downplay the meaning of “HE HIMSELF WILL BE MY SON”.  So I want to ask him this question, was anybody except Jesus called “GOD’S ONLY BEGOTTEN SON”?  Remember, the word for only is yachid and monogenes in Hebrew and Greek respectively.  If I was a martial arts Sensei and I called one of my students ‘MY SON’ is it the same like being called “MY ONLY BEGOTTEN SON”? No.  With that being said lets show you how deceitful Mr. Osama really is with this passage.

 He purposely misinterprets 2 Samuel 7:13-14 and tries to make it David when it actually refers to Jesus!  Don’t believe me, Read 2 Samuel 7:12 –“When your days are fulfilled and you rest with your fathers, I will set up your seed AFTER YOU, WHO WILL COME FROM YOUR BODY, AND I WILL ESTABLISH HIS KINGDOM.” Notice how if the reader starts at vs. 8 of the passage and continue down you will see that it’s talking about a SEED AFTER DAVID AND NOT DAVID. When you see this it shows you that 1.) Osama probably copied and pasted this information from another site or 2.) He purposely left it out to fool his reader.  From seeing it answered before and then having him post it again, I am utterly convinced that Osama is just a liar.

Let us look at Revelation 19:16 "And upon his (Jesus) outer garment, even upon his thigh, he has a name written, King of kings and Lord of lords."  Here we see that Jesus was called the King of all Kings and the Lord (leader or master) of all Lords (masters).  It doesn't prove anything about Jesus being Jehovah, nor ever talks about Jehovah.  

Mr. Osama also lies about this passage because if the reader reads Revelation 19:12-16-

12 His eyes are like blazing fire, and on his head are many crowns. He has a name written on him that no one knows but he himself.                                                                                                                                                         13 He is dressed in a robe dipped in blood, and his name is the Word of God.                                                          14 The armies of heaven were following him, riding on white horses and dressed in fine linen, white and clean.              15 Out of his mouth comes a sharp sword with which to strike down the nations. "He will rule them with an iron scepter."  He treads the winepress of the fury of the wrath of God Almighty.                                                                 16 On his robe and on his thigh he has this name written: KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS.

We see that Jesus was called 1.) The Word of God, 2.) The Ruler of ALL Nations, and 3.) The carrier of the wrath of God himself.  Mr. Osama doesn’t have any knowledge of the word lord “Kurios” in Greek. Strong concordance says this about the word when it refers to the Messiah- 1.he to whom a person or thing belongs, about which he has power of deciding; master, lord a. the possessor and disposer of a thing 1.the owner; one who has control of the person, the master. b.is a title of honour expressive of respect and reverence, with which servants greet their master c.this title is given to: God, the Messiah.  When referring to Jesus, it has always meant a sign of divinity.  Since this term has always applied to God and the Messiah and Muslims believe that Christ is the Messiah then this clearly shows just how divine Jesus really is.  If Osama wants to teach about Christianity he should go out and purchase a Greek concordance and interlinear text. Since he knows where to find the concordance online, thanks to Mr. Mohd, he has no more excuses.

Let us look at Mathew 28:18-20 "And Jesus approached and spoke to them, saying:  All authority (from GOD) has been given me in heaven and on the earth.  Go therefore and make disciples of people of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father (God), the Son (Jesus), and the Holy Spirit (GOD's inspiration), teaching them to observe all the things I have commanded you.  And look! I am with you all the days until the conclusion of the system of things."  Here in this verse we have few points that Trinitarians often confuse.  Trinitarians use this verse very heavily to try to prove that Jehovah or Allah is 3 in 1, meaning that GOD is the father + Jesus + The Holy Spirit.  

This claim is a false one, because when Jesus said in Mathew 28:18-20 ".....All authority (from GOD) has been give to me in heaven and on the earth...." it clearly shows that Jesus had a stronger or higher power over him.  One has to ask himself a very simple question here:  How can GOD say that GOD had given him authority?  It doesn't make any sense, does it?

Also, when Jesus in Mathew 28:18-20 said ".....baptizing them in the name of the Father (God), the Son (Jesus), and the Holy Spirit (GOD'S inspiration)...." he didn't say go and baptize people in my name (Jehovah).  He mentioned his GOD first, then himself (GOD'S messenger), and in GOD's inspiration (The Holy Spirit).  This clearly disproves the claim that GOD IS THREE = GOD+JESUS+HOLY SPIRIT.  

Osama claims that this passage is false based on his own opinion. Now lets the reader read the whole passage of Matt 28:1-20-

1 In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre.                                                                                                                                     2 And, behold, there was a great earthquake: for the angel of the Lord descended from heaven, and came and rolled back the stone from the door, and sat upon it.                                                                                                              3 His countenance was like lightning, and his raiment white as snow:                                                                               4 And for fear of him the keepers did shake, and became as dead men.                                                                          5 And the angel answered and said unto the women, Fear not ye: for I know that ye seek Jesus, which was crucified.                                                                                                                                                                    6 He is not here: for he is risen, as he said. Come, see the place where the Lord lay.                                                        7 And go quickly, and tell his disciples that he is risen from the dead; and, behold, he goeth before you into Galilee; there shall ye see him: lo, I have told you.                                                                                                                         8 And they departed quickly from the sepulchre with fear and great joy; and did run to bring his disciples word.              9 And as they went to tell his disciples, behold, Jesus met them, saying, All hail. And they came and held him by the feet, and worshipped him.                                                                                                                                            10 Then said Jesus unto them, Be not afraid: go tell my brethren that they go into Galilee, and there shall they see me. 11 Now when they were going, behold, some of the watch came into the city, and shewed unto the chief priests all the things that were done.                                                                                                                                                   12 And when they were assembled with the elders, and had taken counsel, they gave large money unto the soldiers, 13 Saying, Say ye, His disciples came by night, and stole him away while we slept.                                                      14 And if this come to the governor's ears, we will persuade him, and secure you.                                                         15 So they took the money, and did as they were taught: and this saying is commonly reported among the Jews until this day.                                                                                                                                                                      16 Then the eleven disciples went away into Galilee, into a mountain where Jesus had appointed them.                          17 And when they saw him, they worshipped him: but some doubted.                                                                           18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.                                19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:                                                                                                                                                                         20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

Anyone reading clearly sees that these comments made by Jesus came after his resurrection. The angels in Matt 28:5-6 gave testament of Christ's crucifixion and told the people present that Christ has risen.  One must ask this simple question, do you believe in the crucifixion of Christ Osama? If not, then why are you posting these scriptures about him, they occurred AFTER the crucifixion!!!  Also lets look at this passage closely. We saw earlier that Christ was crucified, but we also see Jesus telling them “ALL HAIL” which his disciples felled down to worship him!!! If Jesus was just a prophet how come he didn’t stop them. He told them to HAIL him, and they did!!!  Also notice the scripture says to baptize in the NAME, WHICH IS SINGULAR of the Father, Son and the Holy Ghost. That is 3 different beings in ONE!! Which the Greek text clearly shows.

Also, when Jesus in Mathew 28:18-20 said "......teaching them to observe all the things I have commanded you....." well of course Jesus's disciples needed to teach people from what Jesus taught them !!!.  Jesus was GOD's messenger, and God's favorite "Son" at that time.  GOD had inspired Jesus with all the teachings that people need to go and preach worshiping Jehovah, love and harmony to all people.  

If they did needed to teach what Jesus taught them, then they must also teach the crucifixion, which is something that occurred right before these verses, as well as the resurrection of Christ!!! Since Osama clearly mentions this he must believe that Jesus was crucified.  If he didn’t then obviously he wouldn’t be this stupid to mention this.  He is caught red handed by posting out of context. He has proven Jesus crucifixion and resurrection by trying to disprove it.  Also Osama also commits an error by Saying that Jesus was “GOD’S FAVORITE SON AT THAT TIME”.  This contradicts his own holy book the Quran look at Surah 9:30-And the Jews say: Ezra is the son of Allah, and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah. That is their saying with their mouths. They imitate the saying of those who disbelieved of old. Allah (Himself) fighteth against them. How perverse are they!

Mr. Osama himself is guilty of this because Allah says that He takes no "Son". Mr. Osama said that Jesus was God's favorite "SON" at that time. So he does the same thing that Allah forbids. Mr. Osama why do you mention this in your defense of Islam? This is a contradiction to what your own God says. You must not be Islamic since Allah says that only Christians look at Christ as the Son of God.

Also, when Jesus said in Mathew 28:18-20 ".....And look! I am with you all the days until the conclusion of the system of things." he (Jesus) was referring to the Holy Spirit that GOD will send to Jesus's disciples through either Jesus's inspiration or GOD's inspiration to them.  This also doesn't prove that Jesus is Jehovah or Allah.  We must keep in mind that Jesus was not a normal human being.  He was the King of all Kings and the Lord of all Lords as stated above in (Revelation 19:16 .  He had power from GOD, and he was GOD's favorite "Son" at that time.  Jesus had the power to inspire his followers through GOD's Power, because GOD allowed him to do that.

If Jesus wasn’t a normal human being then obviously he was a divine human being!!! If he wans’t normal Osama then explain to us what type of human being he was. Also Mr. Osama said that God inspired Jesus in all of his teachings, but then he says that Jesus didn't tell people to baptize in his name, but yet told people later to baptize in his name after mentioning God's name. Since God inspired him like Mr. Osama claims then that means that God has partners which he ascribes to him which contradicts Surah 9:31-They have taken as lords beside Allah their rabbis and their monks and the Messiah son of Mary, when they were bidden to worship only One Allah. There is no Allah save Him. Be He Glorified from all that they ascribe as partner (unto Him)!

By trying to disprove the Trinity Mr. Osama is actually proving it by1.) calling Jesus Jehovah (lord-Yahweh in Hebrew) in his original paper (notice he modified it in his next trinity rebuttal papers) which is only used to name God, contradicting is unitarian use of Mark 12:29, mentioned below as well as Dueteronomy 6:4 mentioned above, and his own Holy book the Quran in Surah 9:31. 2.) Using Matthew 28 when it shows what happened after the resurrection when Surah 4:157 says he was never crucified 3.)Saying that all of Jesus revelations was inspired by God when he spoke these words after he was crucified which is direct contradiction of Surah 4:157. 4.)Saying that Jesus revelations was inspired when Allah said that he was caught up before he was crucified Surah 4:157-59. Mr. Osama is saying that Jesus spoke these inspired revelations by God after he was resurrected which is something anyone can see when they read all of Matt 28, instead of picking out just one scripture.  If Jesus was resurrected when he said this the he wasn’t crucified which debunks Osama’s own holy book the Quran!!! Ladies and gentlemen you see how by trying to debunk the trinity, and crucifixion Osama is actually proving himself to be a bible neophyte.

Further more about Matthew 28:18-20 from www.jewsforjudaism.org:

Question: Doesn't the command by Matthew's Jesus to, "Go therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing in the name of the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Spirit" (Matthew 28:19) show the existence of a triune deity.

Answer: Matthew 28:19 states: "Go therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing in the name of the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Spirit." Although the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are grouped together, this verse does not prove the existence of a triune deity. The verse merely indicates the author's belief that they are to be mentioned together during baptism. Each is thought to have a function in the initiation of the believer during the baptism ritual. Yet no doctrine of coequality among them is promulgated in this verse.
In the early period baptism was simply in "Christ" (Galatians 3:27) or in the name of Jesus (1 Corinthians 1:13, Acts 8:16, 19:5). The text in Matthew represents a later stage of development, but is still not trinitarian in meaning. The doctrine of the trinity is a still later development.

Yes Matthews 28:19 does show the existence of a triune being. This verse does prove the existence because NAME IS SINGULAR and not plural and the Father, Son and the Holy Ghost are more than a numerical ONE. Read these verses to see how they operate together showing why Matthews wrote it like this:

"After Jesus said this, he looked toward heaven and prayed: 'Father, the time has come. Glorify your Son, that your Son may glorify you. For you granted him authority over all people that he might give eternal life to all those you have given him. Now this is eternal life: that they may know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent. I have brought you glory on earth by completing the work you gave me to do. And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began." John 17:1-5 

"All things have been committed to me by my Father. No one knows who the Son is except the Father, and no one knows who the Father is except the Son and those to whom the Son chooses to reveal him." Luke 10:22

"But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come. He will bring glory to me by taking from what is mine and making it known to you. All that belongs to the Father is mine. That is why I said the Spirit will take from what is mine and make it known to you." John 16:13

"All I have is yours, and all you have is mine. And glory has come to me through them." John 17:10

Just in case Osama or Mohd tries to water down the statements from the Lord Jesus Christ, we appeal to what he believes to be authoritative scriptures to show that the claims made by Jesus affirm that the Lord Jesus is God:

"To Him belongs the dominion of the heavens and the earth: It is He who gives life and death; and He has power over all things." S. 57:2

"To God belongeth the dominion of the heavens and the earth; And God hath power over all things." S. 3:189

"And certainly We! We it is Who give life, and cause death, and We are THE HEIRS." S. 15:23

"Lo! We, only We, inherit the earth and all who are thereon, and unto Us they are returned." S. 19:40

"Jesus said to them, 'Very truly, I tell you, the Son can do nothing on his own, but only what he sees the Father doing; for whatever the Father does, THE SON DOES LIKEWISE. The Father loves the Son and shows him all that he himself is doing; and he will show him greater works than these, so that you will be astonished. Indeed, just as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, SO ALSO THE SON GIVES LIFE TO WHOMEVER HE WISHES. The Father judges no one but has given all judgment to the Son, SO THAT ALL MAY HONOR THE SON JUST AS THEY HONOR THE FATHER. Anyone who does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent him. I tell you the truth, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be condemned; he has crossed over from death to life. I tell you the truth, a time is coming and has now come when the dead will hear THE VOICE OF THE SON OF GOD and those who hear will live. For as the Father has life in himself, so he has granted the Son to have life in himself. And he has given him authority to judge because he is the Son of Man. Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear HIS VOICE and come out-those who have done good will rise to live, and those who have done evil will rise to be condemned.'" John 5:19-29

To show a point, Trinitarians do not believe that the three Persons function independently, but rather they work in perfect harmony and unity. Hence, any reference of Jesus doing what is commanded of him reinforces the Trinitarian understanding of God. This is something Both Osama and Jews for Judaism seem to be grossly ignorant about. What more can you expect from Bible neophytes.

Let us look at Hebrew 5:7 "During the days of Jesus' life on earth, he offered up prayers and petitions with loud cries and tears to the one who could save him from death, and he was heard because of his reverent submission."  Here we see Jesus prayed to God be saved and God HEARD ( in any religious speech the HEARD means that the person has been answer with the prayer) him.

And, So? We all know that Jesus prayed to God to have this cup pass from him but what Osama doesn’t post from Hebrews is this:

Hebrews 2:9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels, now crowned with glory and honor because he suffered death, so that by the grace of God he might taste death for everyone.

Also read the next 2 verses from Chapter 5, which Osama didn’t post:

8 Although he was a son, he learned obedience from what he suffered                                                                              9 and, once made perfect, he became the source of eternal salvation for all who obey him

Notice that Jesus was obedience to the cross, and only he, not Hajj Allah, Muhammad nor the Quran is the source for eternal salvation. This shows why Bible neophyte Osama posted out of context.

Let us look at Mark 12:29 "The first of all the commandments is, Here, O Israel:  The Lord our God is one Lord."  If trinity was a valid belief, then Mark 12:29 would have said "God is three in one".

As mentioned earlier the word “one” in Hebrew, echad never has meant just a single numerical one. The disciples and the prophets knew this.  Remember when you have more than a numerical one working as ONE it is called A UNIT, which is one of the epithets of one.

Let us also look at Acts 3:22 "In fact, Moses said:  Jehovah will raise up for you from among your brothers a prophet like me.  You must listen to him according to all the things he speaks to you."  Here we see Prophet Moses peace be upon him predicting the coming Prophet Jesus peace be upon him.  Acts 3:22 didn't say that Jehovah will come down to earth in a form of a human being.  Moses said in Acts 3:22 ".....a prophet like me.....", which means that Jesus will be a human being like Moses.  If Jesus was Jehovah or Allah himself, then Moses wouldn't have said ".....a prophet like me.....".

If you look at Osama’s explanation, it is more opinion than facts because there is no way possible for us to believe that Jesus wasn’t God based on if Moses wouldn’t have said “a prophet like me.”  Also to show you something else, Osama either has or once had a part on his site talking about Muhammad in the Bible.  The scripture of Acts 3:22 he uses is a reference to Deuteronomy 18:15, 19. Osama himself said that Moses was talking about Jesus so why would he use this also to say that it referred to Muhammad? This lets us know That Mr. Osama doesn’t fairly present the truth.  Now lets look at the passage of Acts in greater detail. If we start from Acts 3:12-25-

12 When Peter saw this, he said to them: "Men of Israel, why does this surprise you? Why do you stare at us as if by our own power or godliness we had made this man walk?                                                                                        13 The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, the God of our fathers, has glorified his servant Jesus. You handed him over to be killed, and you disowned him before Pilate, though he had decided to let him go.                                      14 You disowned the Holy and Righteous One and asked that a murderer be released to you.                                  15 You killed the author of life, but God raised him from the dead. We are witnesses of this.                       16 By faith in the name of Jesus, this man whom you see and know was made strong. It is Jesus' name and the faith that comes through him that has given this complete healing to him, as you can all see.                                               17" Now, brothers, I know that you acted in ignorance, as did your leaders.                                                             18 But this is how God fulfilled what he had foretold through all the prophets, saying that his Christ [1] would suffer.                                                                                                                                                           19 Repent, then, and turn to God, so that your sins may be wiped out, that times of refreshing may come from the Lord,                                                                                                                                                                       20 and that he may send the Christ, who has been appointed for you--even Jesus.                                                     21 He must remain in heaven until the time comes for God to restore everything, as he promised long ago through his holy prophets.                                                                                                                                        22 For Moses said, `The Lord your God will raise up for you a prophet like me from among your own people; you must listen to everything he tells you.                                                                                             23 Anyone who does not listen to him will be completely cut off from among his people.' [2]                                      24 "Indeed, all the prophets from Samuel on, as many as have spoken, have foretold these days.                   25 And you are heirs of the prophets and of the covenant God made with your fathers. He said to Abraham, `Through your offspring all peoples on earth will be blessed.' [3]                                                                     26 When God raised up his servant, he sent him first to you to bless you by turning each of you from your wicked ways."

            1.18 Or Messiah; also in verse 20

             2.23 Deut. 18:15,18,19

             3.25 Gen. 22:18; 26:4

We see that God raised Jesus from the dead, and that Christ fulfilled God’s promise by suffering and dying as well as every prophet from Samuel foretold of that day, in which the crucifixion took place.  Mr. Osama then must believe that Jesus was crucified since he used Acts 3:22 which is the very heart of the passage!  He goes against the Quran, which claims that Christ was never crucified.  Osama is very typical of many Muslim web administrators who foolishly try to discredit the Bible by using scriptures with no content as well as preconceived opinions.

Let us look at Mathew 3:16 "After being baptized Jesus immediately came up from the water; and, look! the heavens were opened up, and he saw descending like a dove God's spirit coming upon him.  Look! Also, there was a voice from the heavens that said: This is my Son, the beloved, whom I have approved."  Here we see how much GOD loved Jesus and how much he admired him.  Jehovah or Allah in Mathew 3:16 was clearly greeting his messenger (Jesus), and telling him how much he loves him.

Osama tries to downplay this verse, Osama seems to have forgotten that Allah doesn’t have a son, so apparently this was Elohim, and not the counterfeit Hajj Allah calling down from heaven. God sayed this only for Jesus which shows us just how special he was. Remember Jesus was God’s ONLY (monogenes) begotten Son. Which goes against the Quran and what Mr. Osama claims.

The devil tempting Jesus 3 times:

In Mathew 4:1-2 "Then Jesus was led by the spirit up into the wilderness to be tempted by the Devil.  After he had fasted forty days and forty nights, then he felt hungry."  One has to ask himself a very simple question here:  Why would Jesus allow the Devil to lead him to the wilderness to try to tempt him if he were God?  This clearly proves that Jesus is not and can not be God!!!.

Mr. Osama makes a very dubious statement by calling "the spirit" The Devil. The scripture doesn’t say that Jesus was led by the Devil, it said the Spirit (Spirit of the Holy Spirit) led Jesus. Lets look at the terms in Greek the language of the NT. The word for spirit is pneumatos and devil is "diabolus". These 2 words are never the same in Greek. Osama says that this proves that Jesus is not God, but what he claims is false. Why? Because the scripture clearly says that Jesus was led BY THE SPIRIT TO BE TEMPTED BY THE DEVIL!!! Not led by the Devil to be tempted. If the Devil would’ve led Christ then in Greek as well as English, we would’ve seen "Lead by the Spirit of the Devil" not led by the Spirit to be tempted of the Devil.

In Mathew 4:5-6 "The the devil took him along into the holy city, and he stationed him upon the battlement of the temple and said to him:  If you are a son of God, hurl yourself down; for it is written He (Jehovah) will give his angels a charge concerning you, and they will carry you on their hands, that you may at no time strike your foot against a stone.  Jesus said to him:  Again it is written, you must not put Jehovah your God to the test."  Here we see that the devil for the second time tried to tempt Jesus and have him do things that would make him doubt his GOD Jehovah or Allah.  Jesus replied to him by telling him that no matter what you try to do, you will never be able to test your GOD (your creator).  The devil was trying to have Jehovah or Allah send angels to Jesus, and Jesus made it clear to the devil that no one can put GOD to the test, and no one can have GOD do anything without the will of GOD.  The devil will never be able to have Jehovah or Allah send down his angels if Jehovah didn't will it.

Mr. Osama is using a Jehovah Witness Bible to attack Christianity as a Whole!! That’s the equivalent of me using the Nation of Islam beliefs to attack Islam as a whole! This scripture can’t prove anything either because in Greek the literal translation is "THE SON OF GOD". There is no "a" –"a son of" present in this scripture in Greek. The "a" would be alpha, there is no "a" or alpha, so therefore Osama’s defense is solely based on a purposely mistranslation of the NT!!! If Osama doesn’t believe me, he can ask a Greek expert on this. His site should be named ANSWERING JEHOVAH WITNESS!!! Osama thinks that Jehovah Witness are Christians? Wow that’s hilarious because they were started here in America and they don’t call themselves Christians, one of my close best friends was one. As long as God is plural and the words describing him are plural, there will never be a true Unitarian Christian. Neither them nor the Muslims have an answer for the plurality of God as expressed in the Bible.  What happen to your beloved NIV Osama?

In Mathew 4:8-10 "Again the devil took him along to an unusually high mountain, and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their glory, and he said to him:  All these things I will give you if you fall down and do an act of worship to me.  Then Jesus said to him:  God away Satan! For it is written, It is Jehovah your God you must worship, and it is to him alone, you must render sacred service."  Here we clearly see that after the devil offered Jesus the world, Jesus told him to go away and to go and worship Allah Almighty or Jehovah.  One has to ask himself a very simple question here:  If Jesus was Jehovah, then how come he didn't tell Satan in Mathew 4:8-10 "It is me whom you must worship" ?  Jesus told Satan "It is Jehovah your God you must worship", which clearly shows that Jesus is not Jehovah!!!.

Mr. Osama again is using a Jehovah Witness Bible. Osama Don’t you know that Jehovah Witness only holds to about 20 Million members worldwide, while Christianity (the largest religion on Earth) has over 1/3 of the entire population. So why are you using a Jehovah Witness Bible to attack Christianity? Well anyway lets look at Matthew 4:7 closely- It says- Jesus SAID unto him (Satan), it is written again, THOU SHALT NOT TEMPT THE LORD THY GOD. The Jehovah Witness Bible is based on the Same Greek Text like any other English Bible (Anyone of them will tell you that) so lets look at the Greek text and compare the 2. Matt 4:7 is the most important verse: it shows Jesus being God, that’s why Osama didn’t start from this verse using a reliable English Bible. The J.W. version says "Jesus said to him. Again it is written. You must not put Jehovah your God to the test." Now look at the Greek scripture-"Ephe (said) auto (To him) O Iesous (Jesus), Palin (again) genraptai (it has been written) ouk (Not) Ekpeiraseis (you will tempt/pressure) Kuriou (Lord/Master) Tou (the) Theos (God) sou (of you). The direct translation is "Jesus said to him (satan) you will NOT TEMPT THE LORD GOD OF YOU. Jesus was the only one being tempted and Jesus told Satan "Thou shalt not tempt the Lord your God". Osama is using scriptures that can’t even exist in the original language of the NT. When Jesus told Satan to worship God, he was talking about himself As well as his father. How? 1.) Jesus was the only one being tempted in the desert and the told Satan "ThOU SHALT NOT TEMPT THE LORD THY GOD" 2.)When he told Satan to worship God using the word "HIM". Osama is a Muslim, so he is more familiar with Arabic not Greek or Hebrew. If Osama claims that no one can answer his Greek references then why is he using a Jehovah witness bible which is well known mistranslation of the Greek Text? Is this your great Greek reference Osama?

Let us look at Isaiah 11:2-3 "And upon him the spirit of Jehovah must settle down, the spirit of wisdom and of understanding, the spirit of counselor and of mightiness, the spirit of knowledge and of the fear of Jehovah; and there will be enjoyment by him in the fear of Jehovah."  In this verse, we clearly see that Jehovah or Allah Almighty will be with Jesus to guide him, inspire him, and to educate him.  That spirit is called the spirit of Mightiness, where God had blessed his messenger Jesus peace be upon him with that holy spirit.  This verse clearly shows that Jesus is not Jehovah.  In Isaiah 11:2 -3 we see GOD Almighty had defined for the meaning of spirit of Jehovah.  It means the spirit knowledge and knowing the full truth, and the spirit of leading people to the path of GOD, and finally the spirit of fearing Jehovah, where Jesus must fear Jehovah and do only what Jehovah command him to do because Jesus is Jehovah's messenger and not Jehovah himself.  

This explanation doesn’t say anything truthful because if one looks at Isaiah 11:2-5, we see that Jesus is coming to judge the Earth and that this would be in the future, just look at “THAT DAY” in vs. 10.  This always refer to the day of the lord in the tribulation. I have been studying end time prophecy for 14 years and I know people who’ve been studying 25-50 years. If Osama doesn’t even know this then how can he explain to us about Christianity?

Let us look at Isaiah 42:1 "Look! My servant (Jesus), on whom I keep fast hold! My chosen one, whom my soul has approved! I have put my spirit in him.  Justice to the nations is what he will bring forth." Here we see clearly that Jehovah or Allah Almighty had called Jesus his servant.  His chosen servant, whom GOD had put the spirit of guidance (as shown in the previous verse Isaiah 11:2-3) into him to guide him and to teach him the truth so he can deliver it to his people, the people of Israel and to nations that will receive his message.  God was talking about Jesus as his servant and not as himself.

Osama still seems to not know anything about Christian doctrine since Christ is classified as both Servant and God.

But he continued, 'You are from below; I am from above. You are of this world; I am not of this world. I told you that you would die in your sins; if you do not believe that I AM, you will indeed die in your sins.’" John 8:23-24

"’Your father Abraham rejoiced at the thought of seeing my day; he saw it and was glad.' 'You are not yet fifty years old,’ the Jews said to him, 'and you have seen Abraham!’ 'I tell you the truth," Jesus answered, 'before Abraham was born, I AM!’" John 8:56-58

"I came from the Father and entered the world; now I am leaving the world and going back to the Father." John 16:28

"And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you BEFORE THE WORLD BEGAN." John 17:5

Interestingly, the Lord had sworn to never give his own glory to any other:

"I am the LORD; that is my name! I will not give my glory to another or my praise to idols." Isaiah 42:8

"For my own sake, for my own sake, I do this. How can I let myself be defamed? I will not yield my glory to another." Isaiah 48:11

Yet Jesus claims to have preexisted in the same glory that the Father had before the creation of the world. This affirms that both Father and Son are the one God Yahweh. Which explains this:

John 10:31-33:                                                                                                                                                        30 I and the Father are one."                                                                                                                               31 Again the Jews picked up stones to stone him,                                                                                                32 but Jesus said to them, "I have shown you many great miracles from the Father. For which of these do you stone me?"                                                                                                                                                                        33 "We are not stoning you for any of these," replied the Jews, "but for blasphemy,because you, a mere man, claim to be God."

Jesus himself said this and they stoned him. So for Osama to say that Jesus wasn’t God because of this matter is fallible since Jesus claimed to be both a servant and God. How many servants have claimed or have been stoned for this? None, except Christ. All Osama has is to try and pick and choose from the bible to support his thoughts.

Let us look at Isaiah 52:13 "Look! My servant (Jesus) will act with insight (inspiration from GOD).  He will be in high station and will certainly be elevated and exalted very much."  Here again, we see GOD talking about Jesus as her servant and not as himself, and is promising that his servant (Jesus) will be well respected and well admired.  GOD will inspire Jesus all the way throughout his ministry so they can learn the full truth.  It doesn't prove anything about Jesus being GOD himself !!!.

Now lets look at Isaiah 52. We see that Jesus is known as a servant but when you continue reading you see especially in Isaiah 53:9 that Jesus was to die!! -And he made hisss grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death; because he had done no violence, neither was any deceit in his mouth.  “In the Hebrew word rendered “death” is an intensive plural. It has been suggested that it spoke of the violence of Christ’s death, the very pain of which made it like a repeated death” (NKJV, footnote, pg 843, Scoffield, 1989).  If we continue reading on we see that the suffering servant, Jesus, dies which again refutes the Quran and Mr. Osama, who is a Muslim.  On page 842 of the footnotes we see that the suffering servant passage actually begins at this point. Ironically, Mr. Osama uses this scripture, which shows us that he didn’t know about this matter or that he believes that Jesus was going to be crucified!!! It’s hard to refute Christianity with scriptures like these, especially those that refute the Quran showing that Jesus was crucified.

Let us look at Mathew 12:18 "Look! My servant (Jesus) whom I chose, my beloved, whom my soul approved!  I will put my spirit upon him, and what justice is he will make clear to the nations."  This verse is similar to Isaiah 42:1 where Allah Almighty or Jehovah calls Jesus his servant and not himself, and promises to inspire him all the way through his ministry.  Let us see the many others who carried GOD's Spirit in them in the Bible:

We know that Christ was a servant but Christ himself claimed to be more than that:

Matthew 12:6 I tell you that one greater than the temple is here.                                                                        7 If you had known what these words mean, `I desire mercy, not sacrifice, you would not have condemned the innocent.                                                                                                                                                                     8 For the Son of Man is Lord of the Sabbath."

Only Yahweh was lord of the Sabbath since he instituted it. Now if this be the case then Jesus was specifically claiming to be greater than Yahweh’s Sabbath. Also we know that Jesus wasn’t the only one with the spirit of God, many carried God’s spirit.

Others who carried GOD's Spirit in them:

Numbers 24:2 "When Balaam looked out and saw Israel encamped tribe by tribe, the Spirit of God came upon him"

Judges 3:10 "The Spirit of the LORD came upon him, so that he became Israel's judge and went to war. The LORD gave Cushan-Rishathaim king of Aram into
the hands of Othniel, who overpowered him."

Judges 6:34 "Then the Spirit of the LORD came upon Gideon, and he blew a trumpet, summoning the Abiezrites to follow him."

Judges 11:29 "Then the Spirit of the LORD came upon Jephthah. He crossed Gilead and Manasseh, passed through Mizpah of Gilead, and from there he advanced against the Ammonites."

Judges 14:6 "The Spirit of the LORD came upon him in power so that he tore the lion apart with his bare hands as he might have torn a young goat. But he told
neither his father nor his mother what he had done."

Judges 14:19 "Then the Spirit of the LORD came upon him in power. He went down to Ashkelon, struck down thirty of their men, stripped them of their belongings and gave their clothes to those who had explained the riddle. Burning with anger, he went up to his father's house."

Judges 15:14 "As he approached Lehi, the Philistines came toward him shouting. The Spirit of the LORD came upon him in power. The ropes on his arms became like charred flax, and the bindings dropped from his hands."

1 Samuel 10:6 "The Spirit of the LORD will come upon you in power, and you will prophesy with them; and you will be changed into a different person."

1 Samuel 10:10 "When they arrived at Gibeah, a procession of prophets met him; the Spirit of God came upon him in power, and he joined in their prophesying."

1 Samuel 11:6 "When Saul heard their words, the Spirit of God came upon him in power, and he burned with anger."

1 Samuel 16:13 "So Samuel took the horn of oil and anointed him in the presence of his brothers, and from that day on the Spirit of the LORD came upon David in power. Samuel then went to Ramah."

The word for Spirit is Ruwach it means these various definitions:

1.wind, breath, mind, spirit a.breath b.wind 1.of heaven 2.quarter (of wind), side 3.breath of air 4.air, gas 5.vain, empty thing c.spirit (as that which breathes quickly in animation or agitation) 1.spirit, animation, vivacity, vigour 2.courage 3.temper, anger 4.impatience, patience 5.spirit, disposition (as troubled, bitter, discontented) 6.disposition (of various kinds), unaccountable or uncontrollable impulse 7.prophetic spirit d.spirit (of the living, breathing being in man and animals) 1.as gift, preserved by God, God's spirit, departing at death, disembodied being e.spirit (as seat of emotion) 1.desire 2.sorrow, trouble f.spirit  1.as seat or organ of mental acts 2.rarely of the will  3.as seat especially of moral character  g.Spirit of God, the third person of the triune God, the Holy Spirit, coequal, coeternal with the Father and the Son 1.as inspiring ecstatic state of prophecy 2.as impelling prophet to utter instruction or warning 3.imparting warlike energy and executive and administrative power 4.as endowing men with variousgifts 5.as energy of life 6.as manifest in the Shekinah glory 7.never referred to as a depersonalised force

Word Usage - Total: 378 Spirit or spirit 232, wind 92, breath 27, side 6, mind 5, blast 4, vain 2, air 1, anger 1, cool 1, courage 1, miscellaneous 6. In the Bible this word is translated more as Spirit, like a divine manefestation, 232 and it is only wind and breath a total of 119 times!!!!

1 Samuel 16:16 "Let our lord command his servants here to search for someone who can play the harp. He will play when the evil spirit from God comes upon you, and you will feel better."   GOD HAS AN EVIL SPIRIT??!!

1 Samuel 16:23 "Whenever the spirit from God came upon Saul, David would take his harp and play. Then relief would come to Saul; he would feel better, and the evil spirit would leave him."

1 Samuel 18:10 "The next day an evil spirit from God came forcefully upon Saul. He was prophesying in his house, while David was playing the harp, as he usually did. Saul had a spear in his hand..."  ANOTHER EVIL SPIRIT FROM GOD??!!

1 Samuel 19:9 "But an evil spirit from the LORD came upon Saul as he was sitting in his house with his spear in his hand. While David was playing the harp,..."  ANOTHER EVIL SPIRIT FROM GOD??!!

What I want to focus on is particularly these verses.  Osama claims that God has an evil spirit.  By doing this he is trying to make the reader think that the spirit that God puts on people can be either good or bad. When one reads the Bible we clearly see that God uses Satan and his minions to carry out his will. This is nothing new.  However unlike the God of the Bible, we see that the evil spirit not God himself is the one who does evil.  Now lets see just how evil Allah really is.

 The Holy Bible teaches that God cannot be tempted by evil and neither tempts anyone with evil; evil being understood as referring to immorality and sin. James 1:13 (c.f. Psalm 5:4-5; Habakkuk 1:13). Remember there is a difference in sending a spirit and actually doing evil yourself.

Yet, the Quran teaches that Allah is the author of evil:

And (the unbelievers ) schemed and planned, and Allah schemed also, and the best of schemers is Allah. S. 3:54

Remember how the unbelievers schemed against thee, to keep thee in bonds, or to slay thee, or get thee out (of thy home). They scheme and plot, but the best of schemers is Allah. S. 8:30

The term for scheme in Arabic is makara which denotes one who is a deceiver, one who is conniving, a schemer. It is always used in a negative sense. Allah is thus seen as the best of deceivers, the premiere schemer and conniving one.

 This is not simply a Christian perspective but one thoroughly endorsed by Muslim theologians as well.

For example Dr. Mahmoud M. Ayoub in his book, The Quran and Its Interpreters, Vol. II The House of Imran , brings up the question of "how the word makr (scheming or plotting), which implies deceitfulness or dishonesty, could be attributed to God." (Ibid. [ 1992 State University of New York Press, Albany ], p. 165 )

After listing several Muslim sources he quotes ar-Razi as arguing that "scheming (makr) is actually an act of deception aiming at causing evil. It is not possible to attribute deception to God. Thus the word is one of the muttashabihat [multivalent words of the Quran]." (Ibid., p. 166)

In fact the Quran furnishes plenty of examples on some of the methods Allah adopts in devising evil:

Remember in thy dream Allah showed them as a few: if he had showed them to thee as many, ye would surely have been discouraged, and ye would surely have disputed in your decision: but Allah saved you: for He knoweth well the( secrets ) of ( all ) hearts. S. 8:43

Allah is said to have shown the opposing fighting forces as few to Muhammad since if he had shown them as they actually were, the Muslims would have been afraid to fight. Hence, Allah had to use deception in order to encourage the Muslims to fight in his cause.

And when We desire to destroy a city, We command its men who live at ease, and they commit ungodliness therein, then the Word is realized against it, and We destroy it utterly. S. 17:16

Allah commands men to sin in order to destroy them completely.

They (Jinns- demon spirits) worked for him (Solomon) as he desired ... then when We decreed death upon him, nothing showed them his death except a little creeping creature of the earth, which gnawed away at his staff. And when he fell the Jinns saw clearly how, if they had known the unseen, they would not have continued in the humiliating penalty (of work). S. 34:13-14

Allah deceived the Jinns into working for Solomon by preventing the latter's death from being disclosed to them, otherwise they would have stopped their work.

Allah also deceived both Christians and Jews into thinking that Jesus was crucified when in fact "it was so made to appear unto them", seeing that he never was crucified or killed. S. 4:157

According to S. 9:51, nothing befalls Muslims except what Allah has ordained. And in S. 14:4, we are told,

"Allah leads astray whomsoever He will and guides whomsoever he will."

And,

"Whomsoever Allah guides, he is rightly guided, and whom He leads astray, they are the losers! We have created for Hell many Jinns and men... Do ye desire to guide him whom Allah led astray? Whom Allah leads away, you will find no way for him." S. 4:87, 90 (c.f. S. 11:118, 120)

Not only does Allah guide people astray, but also has created men specifically for hell. To make matters worse, he even ordains the evil one commits as we have already seen in S. 17:16 and further clarified by this Muslim tradition:

   Abu Huraira reported Allah's Apostle as saying:

Verily Allah has fixed the very portion of adultery which a man will indulge in, and which he of necessity must commit (or there would be no escape from it )." Sahih Muslim # 6421, 6422

To even imagine that Allah causes adultery is not only horrendous but disqualifies him from being the God of Moses.  We see from these examples that Hajj Allah is the god of evil, much like Satan in the Bible.  We also see that Allah had demons working for Solomon.  How can Osama criticize the Bible and God when Allah sends devils and commits acts of evil himself? This is the dilemma Muslim web administrators have yet to explain.

1 Samuel 19:20 "so he sent men to capture him. But when they saw a group of prophets prophesying, with Samuel standing there as their leader, the Spirit of God came upon Saul's men and they also prophesied."

1 Samuel 19:23 "So Saul went to Naioth at Ramah. But the Spirit of God came even upon him, and he walked along prophesying until he came to Naioth."

2 Chronicles 15:1 "The Spirit of God came upon Azariah son of Oded."

Ezekiel 11:5 "Then the Spirit of the LORD came upon me, and he told me to say: "This is what the LORD says: That is what you are saying, O house of Israel, but I know what is going through your mind."

Ezekiel 37:1 "The hand of the LORD was upon me, and he brought me out by the Spirit of the LORD and set me in the middle of a valley; it was full of bones."

Luke 1:35 "The angel answered, "The Holy Spirit will come upon you (Mary), and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. So the holy one to be born will be called the Son of God."

Luke 2:25 "Now there was a man in Jerusalem called Simeon, who was righteous and devout. He was waiting for the consolation of Israel, and the Holy Spirit was upon him."

We mentioned earlier about spirit so there is no reason to reiterate. However we have seen from the definition of Spirit, God specifies who his spirit is. 

Now, why do we have to consider Jesus as the Creater of this Universe or someone who is equal to GOD just because GOD had put His spirit in Jesus, and not consider the many others who carried GOD's spirit above as equal to GOD?

We don’t and we have never did.  We considered Jesus equaled to God because the Bible prophesied about him and because Jesus on numerous occasions claimed to be equaled with God. Something we discussed much earlier in this paper. I don’t know where did Osama get this idea from.  Christians and Jews alike have always known that God puts his spirit on people. Jesus himself said that the Disciples will be endowed with God’s spirit at Pentecost.

Now, let us look at John 4:34 "Jesus said to them:  My food is for me to do the will of him (Jehovah) that sent me and to finish his work." Here we see clearly that Jesus told his followers that GOD is higher than him, and Jesus can only do things within Jehovah's will.  Also Jesus said that his mission is to finish the work of Jehovah that was assigned to Jesus peace be upon him.

When we read John 4:34, we see that Jesus doesn’t say at all that God was higher than him, like Osama claims. Mr. Osama is very good at making claims and accusations that doesn’t exist, this is just another one of his tricks to fool the reader. Since we discuss earlier how the Trinity works in unison, then commonsense would show why Jesus was to do the will of his father. Again Osama tries to answer the Trinity but yet he doesn’t seem to even know the basic meaning of it.

Let us look at John 5:30 "I cannot do a single thing of my own initiative; just as I hear, I judge; and the judgment that I render is righteous, because I seek, not my own will, but the will of him that sent me."  Here we see two things in this verse:  First, Jesus recognized, admitted and preached to his followers that his is nothing special nor have any power in him.  Second, Jesus does nothing of his own will; he only does the will of GOD who sent him and who inspires him.

Mr. Osama must not know about John 5:17-18 –“But Jesus answered them, My father has been working until now, and I have been working.  Therefore the Jews sought all the more to kill him because he not only broke the Sabbath but also said that God was HIS FATHER, making himself EQUAL WITH GOD.”  Literally, “His own Father”-Greek- patera idion.  It is clear that the Jews understood that Jesus was claiming to be God.’” (NKJV, footnote, pg 843, Scoffield, 1989).  Also if Osama reads the verse Jesus clearly says “I SEEK NOT MY OWN WILL”. Why because like the basic understanding of the Trinity, God works as one.

Let us look at John 5:31 "If I  (Jesus) alone bear witness about myself, my witness is not true.  There is another that bears witness about me, and I know that the witness which he bears about me is true."  Here we also see that Jesus admits and preaches to his followers that he is not powerful.  The only powerful is GOD, his GOD.

Jesus never mentioned anything about power.  Mr. Osama is trying to develop a straw man argument and then refute it to show his reader that Jesus wasn’t powerful.  However, talking about a witness is totally different than power.  The Greek word for power is “dhynami”, which isn’t present at all in this verse.  “The Statement here (5:31) might be paraphrased as follows ‘If I testify about myself, you will say my testimony is not valid.’ Against the charge our Lord, in defending his messianic claims urges the biblical rule of evidence which requires two or three witnesses (Num. 35:30; DT. 17:6; Jn 8:17-18).  The additional witnesses are cited in vs. 32-47.” (IBID).  Jesus had to have a witness in order to go along with the rules set by God in the OT.  It’s amazing how Muhammad never had a single witness to verify his alleged call at the cave.  This disqualifies him from being a prophet based on God’s rules.

Let us look at John 5:36-38 "But I have the witness greater than that of John, for the very works that my Father (my GOD) assigned me to accomplish, the works themselves that I am doing, bear witness about me that the Father (GOD) dispatched me.  Also, the Father (GOD) who sent me has himself borne witness about me.  You have neither heard his voice at any time nor ever seen his figure; and you do not have his word remaining in you, because the very one whom he dispatched you do not believe."  Personally speaking, I never had a single Trinitarian explain this verse to me directly.  They always give me indirect answers that have nothing to do with this verse (John 5:36-38).  Here we see Jesus again clearly defines GOD as greater than him, and he told his followers that they have never seen GOD nor ever heard his voice.  I don't know what more Allah Almighty and Jesus need to say to prove to Trinitarians that GOD and Jesus are two separate beings !!!.

Let us look at Deuteronomy 4:12 "And GOD began to speak to you out of the middle of the fire.  The sound of words was what were you hearing, but no form were you seeing nothing but a voice."  This verse is another proof that no one ever seen GOD in any form.

Mr. Osama purposely tries to misunderstand this verse by not reading the entire passage. In my dealing with Mr. Osama, he never really tries to understand Christianity.  He even stooped to cursing Christians out at one time.  If we read John 6:40-41 we see that Jesus came down FROM HEAVEN.  John 6:42-46-

42 They said, "Is this not Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? How can he now say, `I came down from heaven'?"                                                                                                                                  43 "Stop grumbling among yourselves," Jesus answered.                                                                                           44 "No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him, and I will raise him up at the last day.            45 It is written in the Prophets: `They will all be taught by God.' Everyone who listens to the Father and learns from him comes to me.                                                                                                                               46 No one has seen the Father except the one who is from God; only he has seen the Father.

Jesus says in vs. 46 that no one has seen god except HE WHO IS FROM GOD!  Jesus claimed to come from heaven, which makes him the only one who has seen God! Mr. Osama doesn’t understand this verse because unlike the Quran you have to read more than a few verses to understand a point in the Bible. Also Jesus said that the prophets claim that THEY WILL BE TAUGHT BY GOD!  Jesus was the one who was teaching them!!!

Mr. Osama also lies about Deuteronomy 4:12.  He says that God spoke out of the middle of the fire.  Elohim is God in Hebrew and it isn’t present in this verse. The word “Lord” which is Yahweh in Hebrew, not Elohim.  When you look at it in this light you see that it was the Angel of YAHWEH who spoke to Moses in Exodus 3.  This ANGEL CALLED HIMSELF “I AM THAT I AM”. An angel is a man, as well as a heavenly being.  So we see that a man who is called God spoke to Moses. Read Strong’s Concordance on Angel in the OT.—Mal'ak

Definition:1.messenger, representative a. messenger b.angel c.the theophanic angel

Word Origin from an unused root meaning to despatch as a deputy

Who claimed to be God? It was Jesus who was divine as well as a man! Osama continues by saying:

Now in Isaiah 9:6 "......Mighty God,....."

Trinitarians confuse this mistranslated and misinterpreted "Might God" expression with Jehovah or Allah Almighty.  They think it means the actual GOD.  Please note that in the "Kings James Version" Bible, the word "Mighty" in Isaiah 9:6 is "mighty".  The only unique title given to Allah Almighty in the Bible is:  Jehovah, GOD, and GOD LORD.  "God", "Mighty One", and "Most Mighty" are magnifying titles that were given to other people in the Bible that do not refer to Allah Almighty (GOD) himself.  Read further down !.

Does the Bible in the Old Testament confirm trinity?

Let us look at Mark 12:29 "The First is, "Hear O Israel, the Lord our God is One."  Jesus, according to the source of Christianity, in the records that we have of his sayings, never made a claim to be divine.  In an answer to a question on what the first commandment was, he replied by saying God is One.  Jesus was quoting Deuteronomy 6:4.  Therefore, let us examine the Hebrew of this verse:

"Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God, the LORD is one.  (Deuteronomy 6:4)"   Trinitarian Christians claim that this verse states that the LORD is a "compound one"; he is multiple entities or objects combined together forming one GOD.  However, since I do not speak Hebrew, I left it for the Hebrew speaking Jews to respond to them:

The following question and answer were taken from www.jewsforjudaism.org:

Question: The word 'echad, "one," is used in the Jewish Scriptures in either a compound or absolute sense. In what sense is 'echad used in the Shema, "Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is One" (Deuteronomy 6:4)?

Answer: In such verses as Genesis 1:5: "And there was evening and there was morning, one day," and Genesis 2:24: "Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother and shall cleave to his wife, and they shall be one flesh," the term 'echad, "one," refers to a compound united one.

Also remember the word ONE can mean a single thing, but ONE is also a unit! If Osama tries to use Echad as a defense to say that God is just a single numerical one then how in the world can the compound unity of this word be explained away? If Osama tries to use echad as a means of claiming that God isn’t compound he isn’t proving anything.

However, 'echad often also means an absolute one. This is illustrated by such verses as 2 Samuel 13:30: "Absolom has slain all the king's sons, and there is not one of them left"; 2 Samuel 17:12: "And of all the men that are with him we will not leave so much as one"; Exodus 9:7: "There did not die of the cattle of Israel even one"; 2 Samuel 17:22: "There lacked not one of them that was not gone over the Jordan"; Ecclesiastes 4:8: There is one [that is alone], and he has not a second; yea, he has neither son nor brother." Clearly, the word "one" used in these verses means an absolute one and is synonymous with the word yachid, "the only one," "alone." It is in this sense, with even greater refinement, that 'echad is used in Deuteronomy 6:4: "He